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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I like my new Sandero but it seems to be let down by reliability.

At 400 miles( about 60 days ) I have had to call out the breakdown service twice for the same problem- failure to start with a need to return to the main dealer.

Legally new car buyers have 6 months to reject a new vehicle if a fault cannot be repaired by the car dealer satisfactory within this time.

The dealer reported after the first break down "no fault found." obviously they could not identify the problem.

Tomorrow I will have to return the car to the dealer at great inconvenience.
 

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Azurite Blue Sandero Stepway dCi 63 plate (2013) with permanent dashboard illumination.
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I like my new Sandero but it seems to be let down by reliability.

At 400 miles( about 60 days ) I have had to call out the breakdown service twice for the same problem- failure to start with a need to return to the main dealer.

Legally new car buyers have 6 months to reject a new vehicle if a fault cannot be repaired by the car dealer satisfactory within this time.

The dealer reported after the first break down "no fault found." obviously they could not identify the problem.

Tomorrow I will have to return the car to the dealer at great inconvenience.
Does the starter motor crank the engine and engine won't start, or is it just dead and nothing happens when you turn the key ? :confused:
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Does the starter motor crank the engine and engine won't start, or is it just dead and nothing happens when you turn the key ? :confused:
Just DEAD.!

However, It can be started by resetting the computer ,disconnecting and reconnecting the battery as the RAC did

I suspect after doing some investigation the internet that recurring problem could be one of several things including misalignment /damage of physical wheel assemblies ,faulty wheel sensers or faulty wiring.
The difficulty is that there are so many possibilities that finally solving this might take beyond the 6 months period.

Ambvol
 

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Hi ambvol. Sorry to hear about your problem esp since u had great expectations after getting rid of your Vauxhall.
Troubleshooting nowadays is hit & try (mostly miss). They rarely can pinpoint a definite cause/ remedy. So it's always in your mind. It could be anything from your main ECU or multiplex network.
Keep a record. Note the fault codes. Use the car more. If things have to go wrong, let it happen. If u can build up a case, then return it. This has turned out to be unlucky for u.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Hi ambvol. Sorry to hear about your problem esp since u had great expectations after getting rid of your Vauxhall.
Troubleshooting nowadays is hit & try (mostly miss). They rarely can pinpoint a definite cause/ remedy. So it's always in your mind. It could be anything from your main ECU or multiplex network.
Keep a record. Note the fault codes. Use the car more. If things have to go wrong, let it happen. If u can build up a case, then return it. This has turned out to be unlucky for u.
Hi ,
This morning after the RAC visit yesterday, the car started OK and with no problems showing. However I phoned the garage to make an appointment and discus the apparently intermittent problem . His response was sympathy and advise that if the car was not now showing a fault they would not be able to trace ,the problem. It the occurred to me that the common sense thing to do if the non start occurs again is to have the car towed to the garage so that the computer test can see why the car is not starting. Letting the RAC start the car is wiping out the error and resetting the system. The garage advise - run the car again to see if the fault reoccurs.

Yes I will have to build a case. I think its time for writing a letter to mark my concern and a record a milestone.
I have also learnt that letting the RAC start the car by resetting the computer on the roadside appears to hinder any fault finding at the garage, it also does not help a case for rejection if the RAC can restart the car. Although it does not seem right the there is no fault history log in the computer test routine.

Ambvol

Thanks for your response
 

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Hi ,
This morning after the RAC visit yesterday, the car started OK and with no problems showing. However I phoned the garage to make an appointment and discus the apparently intermittent problem . His response was sympathy and advise that if the car was not now showing a fault they would not be able to trace ,the problem. It the occurred to me that the common sense thing to do if the non start occurs again is to have the car towed to the garage so that the computer test can see why the car is not starting. Letting the RAC start the car is wiping out the error and resetting the system. The garage advise - run the car again to see if the fault reoccurs.

Yes I will have to build a case. I think its time for writing a letter to mark my concern and a record a milestone.
I have also learnt that letting the RAC start the car by resetting the computer on the roadside appears to hinder any fault finding at the garage, it also does not help a case for rejection if the RAC can restart the car. Although it does not seem right the there is no fault history log in the computer test routine.

Ambvol

Thanks for your response

This sounds like a sensible course of action.
 

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I have also learnt that letting the RAC start the car by resetting the computer on the roadside appears to hinder any fault finding at the garage
...does explain the difficulty for the garage, but perhaps you might discuss the possibility of a technician being sent out with a laptop to analyse the cause as a cheaper and faster option than load it onto a recovery wagon, as the dealer will have to cover the cost anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
...does explain the difficulty for the garage, but perhaps you might discuss the possibility of a technician being sent out with a laptop to analyse the cause as a cheaper and faster option than load it onto a recovery wagon, as the dealer will have to cover the cost anyway.
I have involved DACIA in the situation. They have said they will be discussing this with the garage,

I suspect that either the technician using the garage computer has missed something or the computer is not able to go down to a level that pinpoints the exact detail or component that causing the problem. As I understand how the computer diagnostics work is any problems in the system are logged in part of the computer system. In my case although I was verbally told that after the first failure to start incident. that the garage found nothing that would cause the car startup to fail they also told me that had adjusted the steering angle.

This tells me that there seems to be an intermittent fault with the ESC because this was also showing on the cars fault picture of the 2nd failure to start. I had a long talk with the service manager before taking the car back to the garage following the RAC breakdown help. He advised me if the car is now starting with no faults showing to give the car another chance

He also said that intermittent faults can sometimes take a long time to pinpoint at the garage. Surprisingly he seemed to think that failure to start and having to call out the RAC would not be considered a good case for rejection . This surely is not what the latest consumer regulations says which is the garage allowed one chance to remedy a new car fault within the first 6 months and if it's not resolved the car can be rejected as being unsatisfactory.

I don't want to do this but I don't want to miss the opportunity of rejecting a car that need taking the car back and forth to the garage or being off the road until a courtesy car is available. Yes the car has a 3 year warranty but can you imagine the nightmare of the car going back and forth to a garage many miles from your home particularly if you are elderly and with walking problems.
 

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The part about 'adjusting the SAS' is strange. The TC light will come on for any injection problem & loss of power (limp mode). I have personally gone thru this. The CEL, Elect warning & TC lights will come on together. Injector misfire code can be due to out of range resistance or voltage. If the TC light comes on, a code is seen in the ABS module (but no ABS light). This code will automatically get cleared in the next 4 normal driving cycles. This doesn't mean there is anything wrong w/ the ABS. In this case the TC light is a 'warning light' & not indicative that the TC is activated.
If there is an ABS problem the brakes will work in Non ABS Mode. TC or ABS issues will not prevent a car from starting & u can drive it w/o those functions.

U said initially that the car is just DEAD!
There is something serious perhaps in the ECU/ Wiring/ Voltage supply. How does the service symbol come on in a car driven only 400 miles? The ECU might need to be reprogrammed if they can't find a fault in the wiring or voltages.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The part about 'adjusting the SAS' is strange. The TC light will come on for any injection problem & loss of power (limp mode). I have personally gone thru this. The CEL, Elect warning & TC lights will come on together. Injector misfire code can be due to out of range resistance or voltage. If the TC light comes on, a code is seen in the ABS module (but no ABS light). This code will automatically get cleared in the next 4 normal driving cycles. This doesn't mean there is anything wrong w/ the ABS. In this case the TC light is a 'warning light' & not indicative that the TC is activated.

U said initially that the car is just DEAD!
There is something serious perhaps in the ECU/ Wiring/ Voltage supply.
My definition of dead was the engine was not turning over. On the first non start occasion the RAC first checked the battery voltage and confirmed it was near fully charged . After disconnecting/and reconnecting the battery ( which presumably reset the computer, the car restarted immediately .

The 2nd failure to start was the same except that on this occasion I saw on the screen spanner and ESC. I presume that if the cars computer detects a failure of the ECS ( if the system is turned on) it could stop a start up until the problem is cleared.( but does it ?) hmm !

It's ironic that for me all these computer systems are really unnecessary I only use the car for an average of a few miles a day with a slow average speed of around 20 Mph (including stops and starts.)
The legislation for new cars has exceeded the real life needs of many users who use their cars for driving in towns . I will never go on a motorway again or go above probably 50/60 mph - yes however the next owner might. I do however need reliabilty /.

This particular Dacia model looked to me to be a people's car like the beetle was in the 60s when the side valve engine lasted 20/30000 mile Beetles lasted 100000 .

Hopefully I can get over this current problem because I am really impressed behind the genius design of the 3 pot engine and do recognise the importance of the importance of the computer control .

Thanks for your interest and responses
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
My definition of dead was the engine was not turning over. On the first non start occasion the RAC first checked the battery voltage and confirmed it was near fully charged . After disconnecting/and reconnecting the battery ( which presumably reset the computer, the car restarted immediately .

The 2nd failure to start was the same except that on this occasion I saw on the screen spanner and ESC. I presume that if the cars computer detects a failure of the ECS ( if the system is turned on) it could stop a start up until the problem is cleared.( but does it ?) hmm !

It's ironic that for me all these computer systems are really unnecessary I only use the car for an average of a few miles a day with a slow average speed of around 20 Mph (including stops and starts.)
The legislation for new cars has exceeded the real life needs of many users who use their cars for driving in towns . I will never go on a motorway again or go above probably 50/60 mph - yes however the next owner might. I do however need reliabilty /.

This particular Dacia model looked to me to be a people's car like the beetle was in the 60s when the side valve engine lasted 20/30000 mile Beetles lasted 100000 .

Hopefully I can get over this current problem because I am really impressed behind the genius design of the 3 pot engine and do recognise the importance of the importance of the computer control .

Thanks for your interest and responses
13 /04/ 2021 Just heard from Dacia who has been in contact with the main dealer garage. They say the same as I was thinking , the next time the failure to start occurs tell the RAC that the car has to be towed to the garage so that they can interrogate the fault.

Ambvol
 

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I had something similar years ago, not with a Dacia, so the garage loaned me a car for the week and let the mechanic use it for 5 days just to commute to work and mileage recorded before anyone says anything. I dropped it off on Monday and by Thursday the problem came out to play. Car fixed all sorted, maybe suggest this if all else fails
 

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I had something similar years ago, not with a Dacia, so the garage loaned me a car for the week and let the mechanic use it for 5 days just to commute to work and mileage recorded before anyone says anything. I dropped it off on Monday and by Thursday the problem came out to play. Car fixed all sorted, maybe suggest this if all else fails
Have done the same in the past too. Sometimes it's the only way.
 

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You don't need to "build a case". The consumer Rights Act is clear: if something goes wrong within 30 days, just give it back. If it goes wrong within 6 months the dealer gets one chance to fix it. All you need is evidence - either from the dealer diagnosis or an independent expert - that something was wrong, which you already have in abundance.

What is the Consumer Rights Act, and how does it affect my vehicle purchase? - The Motor Ombudsman

The problem is one of a more practical nature. Giving back the car leaves you without a car, and no cash until you get your money back. If the car is on finance it may leave you there with complications, too. Dealers know this, and ruthlessly push back because in taking a new car back they may loose thousands. Don't believe anything they say, it is just intimidation.

In 2021 I threatened my Dacia dealer to give my new car back because they couldn't fix it. They knew I have two other cars, and bought with cash, and they went out of their way to fix the problem (which they did):

(15) Dacia cannot repair my 5-month old Logan TCe 1.0 Bi-Fuel ! | UK Dacia Forum

There is a thread elsewhere on this forum by Mickey G who successfully pursued the return of a faulty new Dacia:

(15) Can't solve battery problems | UK Dacia Forum
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
going back to the reason that caused my concern IE the failure to start on two separate occasions. The reason for the problem has not yet been established and I have been told by Dacia to have the car towed back to the garage for them to find out what is preventing the starting . There also is another intermittent problem which I suspect might be a separate problem which is the ESC warning has come on also on two occasions but disappears when the car is restarted.

The first fault jogs a memory from many years ago when I had a similar starting problem and had to have the car at the time towed in. I seem to remember that I was told that it was something to do with the cars anti theft system. IE the key coding for some reason is not being recognised by the cars computer.

I have a dangly metal key ring thing attached to the key ( remote central locking type) perhaps this might be causing interference . The next time I have a starting problem I can at least try the cars spare key to see if this works ahead of calling the garage.

Ambvol
 

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Re your last paragraph ambvol...

Both my wife's and my keys once failed to open the door on our previous (non-Dacia) vehicle. Eventually turned out to be a faulty wireless doorbell whose signal was interfering with the key buttons.

B
 

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Just thought I would share this with you as a caution tell. Last Monday I was shopping in my local Morrison’s and as I walked away from the car it did not lock as usual. I have a Stepway Prestige Mk3.

I only noticed when I returned to the car and found it unlocked. On checking everything when I got home I found it was having my mobile phone in the same pocket as the keycard and it was ‘swamping’ the signal and stopping the remote locking from working.
Just something else we have to be aware of.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
here I am again .
the car won't start again. waiting for the RAC. I tried the car at 7.00am it started perfect and strong. Got in the car at 11 am Car would not start . It hadn't been moved or touched since 7. am .

I think that once again the car can be started but the garage has told me to have it towed back to them . It's weekend they are not open so thats weekend written off.

This is the third time in 3 months that the car has refused to start. It's got to go back to the garage and I will lose my car for an indefinite period .

ambvol
Just thought I would share this with you as a caution tell. Last Monday I was shopping in my local Morrison’s and as I walked away from the car it did not lock as usual. I have a Stepway Prestige Mk3.

I only noticed when I returned to the car and found it unlocked. On checking everything when I got home I found it was having my mobile phone in the same pocket as the keycard and it was ‘swamping’ the signal and stopping the remote locking from working.
Just something else we have to be aware of.
The RAC man this time was able to find the fault after scanning for a few minutes with his diagnosist equipment. The fault appears to be on the BCM . I photographed the page on his tester which highlighted the fault to show to the garage when I return the car to them after the weekend. The RAC man then started the car again as before by disconnecting /connecting the battery. The BCM unit might be called something different by Renault. It is the printed circuit board which lives inside the glove box

Ambvol.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Hi ,
This morning after the RAC visit yesterday, the car started OK and with no problems showing. However I phoned the garage to make an appointment and discus the apparently intermittent problem . His response was sympathy and advise that if the car was not now showing a fault they would not be able to trace ,the problem. It the occurred to me that the common sense thing to do if the non start occurs again is to have the car towed to the garage so that the computer test can see why the car is not starting. Letting the RAC start the car is wiping out the error and resetting the system. The garage advise - run the car again to see if the fault reoccurs.

Yes I will have to build a case. I think its time for writing a letter to mark my concern and a record a milestone.
I have also learnt that letting the RAC start the car by resetting the computer on the roadside appears to hinder any fault finding at the garage, it also does not help a case for rejection if the RAC can restart the car. Although it does not seem right the there is no fault history log in the computer test routine.

Ambvol

Thanks for your response
after the latest and 3rd breakdown I have considered going down the path of rejection using the legal consumer protection law and it appears to offer little comfort to me. Although I could make a reasonable argue that the car is unreliable IE 3 breakdowns in 400 miles .

I would suffer a significant financial loss on the original cost IE the DACIA Agent would probably not return his delivery charge and would argue that I used the car for X months and this would amount to a significant cost of car rental rental equivalent which would be deducted from any final settlement. IE if a nominal car rental was say £100 per week 14 weeks would be be a loss of £1400 . This plus the loss of the agents cost of car delivery of £600 I can see would I would lose at least £2000 from the original purchase price.
It seems silly but it could be almost the same as selling the car back to the dealer.

Ambvol
 

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Ambvol
Do I assume that after another post else ware on this forum that your troubles have been sorted ?
Roger ;)
 
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